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PAGE FC = 'Sinclair and Premier Battle Over Ballot Issue in Legislature]: Premier Insists Liberal Lead- er Take Stand in Investi- gation But Latter Refuses «Sharp Exchanges Across Floor of the House Toronto, Feb. 21. -- Investiga- tion into the mystery of the 19 "wandering ballots," presumably ¢rom the Provincial election held December 1, 1926, in the electoral district of South Ottawa will open officially at Queen's Park this morning, To expedite the inquiry, the On- tario Legislature, in record time yesterday, put through and obtain ed Royal assent to an amendment to the Election Act whereby all ballot papers from the South Ot- tawa electoral district, now in pos- session of the Clerk of the Crown in Chancery, will be subject today to the scrutiny of the Committee on Privileges and Elections, by which the probe will be made. Liberal Leader William E, N. Sinclair will attend the hearing, determined, as he told the House yesterday , that the committee will not make a fool out of me," and prepared 'to sit in until ev- ery ballot is counted unless I'm gent down to jail for refusal to give evidence," This stand of Mr, Sinclair's was taken yesterday in the face of Premier Ferguson's declaration that "the honorable member will go into the witness box if there is any machinery in the law to compel him to;" even after the amendment, as brought down to the House, indicated in effect that none might be excused from testi- fying at the inquiry if the commit- tee willed; and, generally speak- ing, following the hottest verbal "gerap" the two party leaders have ever staged before the As- sembly--a scrap in which, at times, tempers wore clean through, faces whitened, jaws set, and voic- es broke under the stress of cross- floor battle, and from which the "slim" galleries of the afternoon got their "kick" of a lifetime, Premier in Angry Mood Premier Ferguson, to borrow Mr, Sinclair's phraseology, had *sttam up," His coal supply seemed unlimited, and he burned all he had, He charged the Liber- al Leader with starting the whole "ballots business" for political capital, and with side-stepping it once he had "disseminated {ts odor" about the Province, He charged him with acting *'child- fsh;" with offering contempt to the Legislature and to the com- mittee; with making "nebulous, loose, irresponsible statements he was not prepared to substantiate; and with the attitude of mind of one who once the Bible was put in his hands and was asked to swear would "turn tail and run away" from his responsibilities to the people, if not to his party or to the Legislature." "This committee -- Mr, Fergu- son launched his most withering blast--"would not be functioning as it should if it did not subpoena Mr, Sinclair as the first witness, put him in the witness box, and lay the proper foundation of the inquiry." Sinclair Talks Back While the Prime Minister had a wallop in either hand, Mr, Sinclair was not averse to "trading" them with him. He reiterated denial that he could nave brought the "ballots business' before the House in any other way than he had done, He accused the Prime Minister of delivering a "tirade" at the second reading of the bill, when only he principle of the Leg- islatiton should have been spoken to. He said that the Prime Minis ter had given him a 'pretty spanking" because he, the Prime Minister, was jealous of the news- paper publicity his debate speech had eafned for him. He sald that while the principle of the amend- ment was just another "thumb- screw and stake affair -- "a cun- ning bit of work by somebody' -- no committee would "make a fool out of him," and that he refused to be placed "on trial" before the House, Black Maria or no Black Maria, he would see the inquiry through and 'no backing up." On three different occasions the Liberal Leader white-faced and tense plainly nettled by the Prime Minister's fire appealed to the Speaker. of the House for rulings on points raised, Twice the Speak- er reserved judgment, The third time noticeably exasperated too, the Speaker gave the verdict to the Prime Minister and amid the banging of the Conservative benches told the Liberal Leader that he had "butted in" too much and that he would "have no more of it," Hour-and-a-Half Battle Throughout the hour and a half of battling over the "ballots" is- sue, Opposition and Government members sat as if electrified, There was a visible sigh of relief when the air cleared and when His Honor the Lieutenant-Gover- nor William D, Ross, marched up the aisle of the Chamber, quiet, OSHAWA DAILY TIMES, TUESDAY, FEBRUARY 21, 1928 ballots sent out to this electoral district at the last election and re- turned, either used or unused, will be bared for inspection, Starts Quietly The drama of the afternoon started off mildly, with Attorney- General Price introducing the Government's bill to amend the Election Act, Smilingly Col, ' Price told the calm and peaceful ! Legislature: "This provides for an amendment to enable the House by its direction to inspect ballots in the ballot boxes in the hands of the Clerk of the Crown in Chancery." Opportunity for the inspection of various documents in connec tion with an election was given under one section of the act, he explained, but under the next sec- tion, it is clearly set out that no person shall be allowed to inspect ballots in the custody of the Clerk of the Crown in Chancery except under an order from the Supreme Court, The order might be made on application to a Judge, this authority being satisfle by afida- vit or other evidence on oath that inspection was required for prose- cution, protest of the election or petition, "The hongrable member for! South Ontario," he continued, "stated that he had 19 ballots that look at least as If they re- | semble those used in the South Ottawa election, I pointed out to him before the committee that he could have applied within the | year and received an order from the Judge to examine the ballots --the ballots being placed in the hands of the Registrar of the Ap- pellate Division, and I feel that the Judge would have given him the order necessary -- though he notified us on October 25--we are, as indicated by the Prime Minis- ter, introducing a bill to the House | which will enable this House to inspect the ballot boxes, This amendment is a general one that will apply not only to this elec- tion, but to any election in the future, Wants More Information "I hope that when my learned friend reaches the Committee on Privileges and Elections he will be able to give a little more in- formation than he was able to give last Friday morning," the At- torney-General added. Then, concluding, he proposed "to advance the bill for second reading." "I don't like to set up my legal opinion against a counsel as em- = inent as the Attorney-General," passed. Price -- How long did you have the ballots in your posses. on Writes Same Day Mr, Sinclair--~Not more than a day or so I believe. I wrote the same day to Mr, Dymond (Chief Election Officer). Col, Price--Nearly ten months after the election, Mr, Sinclair--Yes. And I have no more information than I had, The information is in the box con- taining the returns at Ottawa. Col, Price -- Ave you prepared to give more information before the committee? ' Mr, Sinclair--I can't give what I haven't got. I won't go as far as some might, I don't want the impression to go from this House that I didn't do my duty. I was- n't anxious to have to pay the costs of an application, 1 don't belong to a party as rich as that to which my honorable friend be- longs to go to a source to get the costs, Col, Price -- 1 thought you had rich friends at Ottawa, Mr, Sinclair--At any rate I am not criticizing the bill, It gets my hearty support. Col, Price--Are you prepared to give more information before the committee tomorrow? Mr, Sinclair -- I have already told you I cannot give what I haven't got, Mr, Ferguson--Now that he's spread the news around---now that he's disseminated the odor through- | out the Province he prefers to back away from it and let it drop, Mr. Sinclair--No I don't, To Proceed With Inquiry Mr, Ferguson--] want to say, right here and now, that this Government has no intention of letting the matter drop. (Ap- plause.) My honorable friend can- not treat this House or this com- mittee with contempt, (Applause.) Mr, Sinclair--I object, Mr, Speaker, There is no such word as contempt. It is unparliamentiary, Opposition benches banged thelr support, A few voices cried *Or- der!" Mr, Sinclair--I ask your ruling, Mr, Speaker, Mr, Ferguson--All Mr. Speaker, you may rule. Mr, Speaker--I reserve my rul- ing on the point raised, The House laughed loudly, Must Give Evidence, Says Premier Mr. Ferguson, still bristling, re- turned to the attack. "The other day," he said, "I suggested to the honorable member that he go be- fore the committee and give them right, bership. Whatever benefits i] every citizen, capitalist, property owner, merchant, professional man, executive or wage-earner, TRUTHFUL FACTS AN AUXILIARY ORGANIZATION TO THE OSHAWA CITY COUNCIL ON THE OSHAWA CHAMBER OF COMMERCE .__~ The Oshawa City Council has for years aided in the Growth of the City of Oshawa. But the time has come when the Representatives of the people require an organization to assist and speed the work for a Greater Oshawa, That organization, the Oshawa Chamber of Commerce, repre- sentative of men and women in every vocation and trade in Oshawa, will strive for a Greater Oshawa. THE SERVICE RENDERED: -- To Actively Encourage: INDUSTRIES TO OSHAWA A LARGER BUILDING PROGRAM INCREASED TOURIST TRAFFIC benefits the city as a whole whether manufacturer, 2. DEMOCRATIC CONTROL The Oshawa Chamber of Commerce will be rum by the membership at large and not by a small group of men. The members will nominate and elect the Board of Directors by secret ballot, con- ducted by mail. In every particular the control of the Chamber of Commerce will be in the hands of its membership, The organization has no politi- cal, social or religious tests. The only questions asked are: Do you want a better and bigger Osh- Four Essentials to a Successful Chamber of Commerce 1. REPRESENTATIVE MEMBERSHIP The Oshawa Chamber of Commerce must have a large, reprsentative, active and interested mem- 3. ADEQUATE INCOME The Oshawa Chember of Commerce must mot only be supported by the representative man-power of the community; it must slso have adequate financial support in order to accomplish results and carry out the wishes of its members as for- mulated in 8 Program of Activities. With its mem- bership dues fixed at the rate of $25.00 annually, and its Activities Fund of $8,000, boty pledged for the period of three years, the Oshawa Chamber of Commerce will be assured an adequate income which will enable it to win for its supporters a zich return upon their investment of faith, energy and money, 4. DEFINITE PROGRAM OF WORK The Oshawa Chamber of Commerce will not open an office and then "wait for something to turn up." From fits very inception it will start turning things up in carrying out a definite plan of activi- ties. This plan, or program of work, will be based all the information in his 1 have since read the of the committee and find that he took the position that he was not called upon to give any information. When I hear the honorable mem- ber refuse to tell anything and re- fuse to be a witness I say he will 80 into the witness box if there is any machinery in the law to com- pel him to." Government benches whammed loudly, . Mr. Ferguson--Yes, he gets be- fore the committee and declines to give evidence. Mr, Sinclair--I told you all I know, Mr. Ferguson--Mr. Speaker, it's almost childish for any one to make such a statement, . Objects to Word Used Mr. Sinclair--Mr, Speaker, I ob- ject to that word, childish, I sub- mit that it is not Parliamentary, The Prime Minister tcied to wave the Liberal Leader down. The lat- ter stuck to his feet. 'You're not the Speaker," he flung across the floor, Mr, Speaker--I'm not prepared to say whether the word "childish" is unparliamentary or not. I will take the matter under my consid- eration, Mr, Sinclair, white and breath- less, subsided, while Government supporters applauded, Premier Ferguson--Well, I'll say that my honorable friend acts as I would expect a child to act. That's not unparliamentary, But, to continue: My honorable friend 'produces ballots, which, he says, , somebody has sent him. He 13 a lawyer, He must know that this is all pure hearsay--not a proper foundation for an inquiry of any kind. The firsy step 1s to produce the ballots, then tell where he got them, then produce the person vho found them, then ascertain the circumstances ascertain whether these are genuine ballots at all or not, My honorable friend is not doing his duty as a member of this House, when he produces certain papers he alleges to be ballots, and says they were sent to him, and refuses to say who the man was who sent them. If that is not treat- ing this House in a most contempt- uous way, I'd like to know what is. The Premier held that it was Mr, Sinclair's duty to have inform- ed the Attorney-General of tho sit- uation, and Mr, Price would have assisted him in getting the neces- sary court order, "I don't pro- pose," he continued, "to let my honorable friend or any other member get up in this House and insinuate or suggest, for an ap- parently political motive, that there was any wrongdoing in an election conducted by this Govern- ment, and then back away from any responsibility," Mr, Sinclair, he went on, could have got the neces- sary court order and the supporg of the Attorney-General, if the Attor- ney-General had been consulted, would have been given, even to a settlement of the costs, Mr. Sinclair, protesting, argued that he had done what he could in writing the Clerk of the Crown in Cancery. "I hope you'll try and he fair," he told the Premier. "You withheld your remarks the other day. But now you've got your steam up." "Well," retorted Mr. Ferguson, "when I read that my honorable friend goes before the committtee and refuses to tell anything that he knows, then I say I have a different attitude. I say that my honorable friend is playing miserable party politics," "And Yom Also" Mr, Sinclair--Is he the only one doing it? Aren't you doing it right now? Mr. Ferguson--Not a bit of it. My honorable friend got all the * publicity he desired-- Mr. Sinclair--And it made you Sore. Mr, Ferguson--Not a bit, for I knew thdt you were going to «umble into this hole, Continuing, the Premier stated that Mr. Sinclair should go into the witness stand in committee and cell what he knew. Mr. Sinclair--Are yon coming down to make me go into the box? Mr. Ferguson--I may be there. But I have no doubt from the atti- tude that you've taken today that when you're to take the Book in your hand, and take the oath, you'll run away, Mr. Sinclair--Come down and see me run away, I won't le. Committee to Decide Mr, Ferguson--My honorable friend is just as much subject to the committee as I am or any other member. When he takes the oath and says that he doesn't know any- thing more, them the committee will decide. The Liberal Leader protested the Premier's attitude. The Premier protested the Liberal Leader's pro- test. Mr, Sinclair--Are you speaking in favor of or against the bill? Mr. Ferguson--You just wait. The bill will go through and you'll have ample opportunity. Mr. Sinclair--I want a ruling. Mr, Speaker--You"ve interrupt- Sinclair--I will again. Speaker--You will not, Mr. Sinclair--I have a right. Mr. Speaker--You've butted in two or three times--if you will pardon that language. Mr. Sinclair--Oh, anything goes here. Mr. Speaker--I will not allow ed. Mr. Mr. this, but in further debates. Mr. Sinclair--Is the Premier jus- tified in going as far afield as he has and attacking me? This is the CHRIST FOR ALL~ALL POR CHRIST OUR EXHORTATION -- My mouth shall speak the praise of ihe Lord, and let all flesh bless his holy mame for ever and ever.-- Psalm 145: 21. PRAYER--Lord, let my soul live and it shall praise Thee. second reading of the bill I thought he was confined to speak- ing on the ple. Mr, Speaker--I cannot sea that the Prime Minister is not right in everything so far, Mr, Sinclair--I may say that that helps the rest of us oug a whole lot from now om, Mr. Ferguson continued, The Lib- eral Leader, sald he, had made "nebulous, loose, irresponsible statements which today he is not prepared to substantiate." Inquiry "I am telling him," the Premier continued, "that this 1s too serious a matter to allow him or any one else to trifle with or to make po- litical partisan capital, There is going to be an investigation to the fullest extent whether my honor- able friend takes part in it or not. Having made these charges, creat- ed this impression, I say that my honorable friend is not playing his part as a member of this House, as a Leader of his great party, or as a citizen of this Province when he declines to assist that commit- tee." The committee, the Premier con- tinued, would not be functioning if it did not subpoena Mr, Sinclair as the first witness, put him in the witness stand, and "lay the foundation of the inquiry." The committee he declared 'should see to it" that this was done. The com- mittee he continued, would at any rate investigate every ballot in ev- ery box whether the Liberal Leader gave evidence or not. "As long as this Government Is in charge of public affairs in this Province there's going to be at least honesty in this Administra- tion," the Premier declared, "whe- ther at an election or not." To Push Bill Through Continuing, Mr, Ferguson stated that the House would go on to deal with the bill in its further legis- lative stages, and that he had heen trying to get the Lieutenant- Governor to come to Queen's Park and give assent to the bill "I hope," he added, 'that my honorable friend will reconsider his attitude, and if not for himself or his party, at least on behalf of the general public, will give the com- mittee all the assistance he can, and tell from whom the ballots came--whether from a garbage heap, a printing shop or a ballot box. It is important that we should know that." Then Aurelien Belanger (Liber- al, Russell) took a hand in the dis- cussion, He thought that the Pre- mier might have spoken "with bet- ter grace." "If," he went on, *the honor- able member from South Ontario had withheld all he knew--and then sprang it at the present time as a surprise--" "He did," shouted Government members. Differ from Government "lI beg to differ," retorted Mr, Belanger. "He communicated with 'the proper officials." Mr. Ferguson--He wrote and asked that the ballots be not ue- stroyed. He said nothing of nine- teen ballots. Mr. Sinclair--May I make a statement here, The files will show Throughout its long Montreal has always and Irish----while the use of English on one side of the coin and French on the other is significant of the mingling of the two races in this country, "Trade and Agriculture" indicates the early connection of the Bank with both urban and rural life in Canada. the financial needs of all the people. BANKOF ONTREAL Established 1817 (_ Total Assets in excess of $830,000,000 R. S. MORPHY Manager Oshawa Branch history the Bank of been active in serving wil that I said, "I have in my p sion evidence of irregularities in the South Ottawa election." Mr. Belanger thought that this communication should have result- ed In action by the Government authorities. At least it was not "up to" Mr, Sinclair to go farther than he had dome. 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