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li} 34 '"' j Mr BLAKE did not iatend in thoss | resoletions, or bis remarks thereon, to poink | particulatly to the hou. member for Lseds " No doubs, ho (Mr. B ) had referred to his bolding an office under Goverament, but it was the hon. Attorney General who spoke of it as a position of emmolument He (Mr, B ) ' did not allude to it in that light at all, Atty Gencral MACDONALD--Bat Tar | Grome did. i -- Mr. BLAKE wished to remind his hon ' friend thot it was not Tus Goose that was now snesking. tor of that journal, -- With regard to the question, o had brought no charge against this Goverament -- They hal acted under an existing law, and ko did not blame them for it, but he condemuned the principle. He hadl no doubt tho hon. member for South Lesds felt sorry that he had accepted the office. 1t was unfortunate for ths hon genutleman that he had received tha appointiment at the t'tms be had chanvged his views. Hs (Mr. B ) did npot condcemn anything that had beon dous in the past, but were wo never to advance? Were we to remuin stationery forever? It was asserted by ths hon. members ol)posite, that this had ouly re--enacted the old law of 1848; but public opinion kad ad-- vanced, avd required &n improvemsut on that old law. Experience hai proved that the law of 1848 was a bad one, and that many abuses existed under it, 'The tendency of legislation was to limit ths number of paid servauts of the Crown who could holl seats in this House, and it was thsrefors rs-- trograding to revive the old law of 1343. The Hon,. Provincial Secretary complaiaci that he (Mr. B. ) was only thooriziag. Oaly the other day he brought in a mattor of p--a> tical legislation, and the hon. gontleman op-- posed it. It was impossible to plassatha hoa Provincial Secretary for whether hs (VMr. B ) theorized or introduced practisal msasures, the hou. member condemusd him, (Cries of six o'clock.) Attorney--General _ MACDONALD--I'm not so sure of that. Mr. BLAKE resumed. He saidl that it had been urged that the analogies hs hal made were not appropriate, He had referrel to the cassa of registrars, and he had said that be thought they held at the ploasurs of thse Government, although the fess of the offise were not received from the Crown. _ 1t was held that the simple fact that the officer was thus usder the authority of the Governmsnt was sufficient to bar his admission to ths Houso, -- But take the caso of* the Crowa coursol. The country had to expend certain money ia Crown counsol business. _ Cerbain crimra's were to be tried, and certain Qareen's coursel had to be appoointed; but it was beld that no Queen's crunsel, being a member of Parliament, could hold this ofti :o. And why? Because they received a pesuni-- ary favour, _ And this was a temporary case; he was simply given aun Assize,aud there was an end of the cceupation--there was cud of the favour of the Crown; but yet is was held that the Coverement had no right to give it to a member of Parliament. Hion. Mr. CAMERON--1 may montioa that it is in the power of the Goavernmont to increase the fees of the ~rown officer. Mz BLAKE rominded the hon. gentloman that at one time he had himself sat in a Gov-- ernament under the lsadership of the proprie continued. Je hou Commissionaer of Crown Lands in particalar had gone bask, as usaal, tothetaking of Qaebec by Wolfe, and raked up all the precedents he could find to continug & principle which tended strongly t> subvert the independencs of the House. He {Mr. 0.) would support the resolutions of the hou. membor for South Bruce. Mr. FLTZ41IMMONS$ said he did not con-- sider these resolutions were throwing any discredt on the hon. member for Leeds, of the hop. member for Grey. Ths priaciple they contained was a good oas, and would reccive is support. Mr. ELAKE said it might be in the powero! | the Government; but they also knew that car-- | tain regulstions were observed in the cass of Crown counsel. In that case is sesmsod to him that the CGovernment, sesing that tho Crown had practically nothing to do with Mr, BLAKE was perfectly aware that magistrates were appsinted, and that they received fees ; but did the hoo. gentioman mean to say that that was vight ? Atty--Gon. MACDONALD--Yes. Right. Mr. BLAKE said ho supposed hs wished bim to includo those gentlemen in the reso-- lution. It seemod to him that it was impos -- sible to contend againet the proposition that the power ,which the Crown could exersiss in tbhis matter, was calculated to im pair the independence of the Houso just as much as those which the Crowna was for-- bidden to exerciso. The Crown had basa rightly forbidden to give other officss ani employment to members of Parliament bs-- cause it tended to impair their indopendencs, not because, as the Hon. Commissioner hail Atty--Con, MACDONALD--How about the masistratos ? the fees dispensud, simply appointed a man who should make this profit ; and the law eaid tvat the man who should be appointed to this place of profit should not be elected a member of the Legislature. said, that they must necessarily vote wrong, but because it might toend to produce that result, that it might chance to produce this result. 'The principle he sup-- ported was that the Governmentshould have the power of influencing the memberz of the House; whether the emolument was payable by the Government or not, was immaterial He ventured to hope that the opiaions of those who had suggested that this was a voke ' of censure upon the Government, would not prevail; at any rate,he did not balieve that it would prevail in the country. _ He believed : that his motion would be received as it was | put, viz: as a motion to assert the view that it was not fair that these things should con-- | tinue. He hoped that the matter would go in this light to the country, , _ Mr. CARNEGIE said althougch the regis. | trars received their fees from the public, yet | they were appointed for life, but could ba re. moved at the pleasure of the Government, '| Therefore the Government could always hold this dismissal as a whip over the head of such an official. _ The other case, of Qusan's ; counsel, although they were appointed solely | for the Assizes, yot the appointments wore AFETER RXESE3S. Mr. McKELLAR said if he hadl doue 80, it was to the member who keld an appoiah ment, and who was in receipt of emoluamsuts. \| Hs thought that if there was any subjact \ which the House should doal with, it was | that of prevonting the employmeat of msem-- . bers of this House by the (Government. Ths (| Commissioner of Crown Lands had gone back \| some ten years to trace up the history of tha l country, to show that he, himself, had al-- || weys been a consistent Reformer, That '| was altogether aside from the question under || discussion; but he hoped, that thers wore || very few such Reformers as the hon,. Com-- !| misgioner of Crown Lands, at the present day. Now, as for the Attornoy--(teneral, the | hon, gentloman arose herse, aad told the || House that the vots was one of want of con-- fidence in the Government., Whether it was or not, it was a proper ong to discuss and 2 . Buttha Honse would have au Atty. General MACDONALD--Yes ho did to the member for South Leeds. "**Aa year after year, at the discretion made, year after year, at the discretion of the Government ; and the same argument would a'so apply in their case. Mr. McKELLAR regretted exceedingly that the Government should have thought it directed ag?lnst the two hon membars al-- luded to. _ The hon member for South Braco had not alluded to them. m 2s T o lcet vote upon. But the House would have an opportunity . of seeing the efforts of the Patent Combination to assure themselves from 'defeat. He had pursued the sams course--he had taken the initlative of assur-- ; ing himself from defeat, and he has movad | the six month's hoist, and if that failed, ho , had an invention at hand by which he could | tuin round _ and save himself, Thers | was _ no _ difference in _ their being | defoated,--it _ was _ all the same, for they possessed an invention which would always keep them in power for ever. It simply was--to move & six month's hoist, and if that was lost, to turn round and sup-- port the motion and keep your geats (Cheers . and laughter.) -- He should vote for this mo:-- tion and for any motion that would deprive the members of this Government, or ary Government of any power by which they could exercise influence over the members of this House It was contrary to hamaz rature to say that if powers were conferred upon them, if offices of care wera givan to thom by which they derived profs, thsy ' would not sympathize and support tha:e | gontlemen who had given them theae offises, ' He thougchs ths§ ths hon.goutleman had been very l}i\furt'ana.ts in tha illustration that hs had given of Mr. Gladstone having been ap-- pointed by the Imporial Government. In the first place, he rsccived no pay for those services, and was a man eminontly qualiGei for the services that hs had performed. Atty Gen. MACDONALD--Aad the hon, member for South Leeds was not ? Mr, MeKELLAR said ho did not suppose that that hon. gentloman would say that ho was ciminently qualified for his dutics above his follows as wes Mr. (Madstons for his. It happened that that goutleman was all that time the leader of the Opposition at the tims he was sppointed, and it also happened in this cage that the hou, member for Lesads had gone over "body, bone and breeches," be-- foro he raceived the appointment, and had voted for the Government. Ho only desivred to see it goto the country, and let the coun-- try judgs whether his hon. friend's resolu-- tion was a propor one, aud whethor the opp> sition which the Government would give to them shculd be approved {by the people. (Cbheors ) Mr LOUNT said the hon gentlioman was had just taken his seat hadl oxpressed his willingness to be judged by the country. So did he (Mr. L ) desire to have his coursse criticized by the country, but before closing the discussion ho dGesired to show the sophistry with which the invidious attack of the hon. members opposite was covered. It was not the principle which thoy opposed, it was an underhand attack on the Govorn-- ment, Now what was the professed style of these resolutions ? It was to provent hon. members from recoiving positions of emolu-- ment under Government, -- He did not think that the position of an arbitrator outside of the House could in any way ianterfere with the indepsndencs of that momber inside the Houss, Ths hon member for Bruce should have corstructed hisresolntions in such a way as to prevent the mombsrs of this RHouss from receiving their usual allowance of sta tioznery, ctc , every Session; he should havo prevented relatives, counsins, wives and all having counsction with mombers of this House (laughter} from recsiving officos under CGovernmont. He would vote for the amend-- ment. Messrs. BAXTER and SEX TON followed and the amendment was carried on the fol-- lo wing division:-- YEras--Messtrs. Barber, PBeatty, Boulter, Calvin, Camerun, Crlng, (London), Caraegie, Cockburna, Code, Folquhoun Corby, C.aig, Glengarry), Craig, (Russel), Currie, Grahams, (York), Hays, Hooper, Lauder, Lount, Lyon, Macdonald, Matchett, Moubeith, Read, Richards, Rykert, Scott, (Groy), Secord. smith, (Kent), Smith, (Leeds and Grenville), Strangs, Tett, ¥ alis, Wigle, Wilson, Wood --36,. NAys--Messr:. Baxter, Blake, Fitzsimmons, Fraser, Galbraith folk), McKellar, MeK im, Mc ¥u Perry, sexton, Sinclair, Spring (Namilton)}. --21, ~AYs--SMesers. Baxter, Blake, Boyd, Chri:tie,Evans, Fitzsimmons, Fraser, Galbraith, Gow, McUall, (Nor-- folk), McKellar, MceK im, Mc Uurrich, Olivor, Pardes, Perry, sexton, Sinclair, Springor, Trow, Williams, (Namilton) --21, Mr. BLAKE moved the second resolution, and said it was not consistent with the main. tenance of this House that any member of it should receive contracts from Government. It appeared from a statoment made before his constituerts by the hou. member for Halton that he had recsived a countract from Covernment and entered into it withoutthink-- ing or without caring how it damage1 his position in the House. His circumstances were such that the value received would not effect his vots in the House. But it was a viclation of a sound principle, and the hn leader of the Governmsnt told the msmber tor Halton that he shouldsupport his Gavern-- ment because he used his blankets and papsr. Atty--General MACDONALD-- I was only joking." Mr BLAKE said he know kis hon friend would try to excuse himse!f on that ssore, but it would not do. People did not joke in & passion, as the hon, leader of the Govern ment undoubtedly was when he spoke to Mr Barber. That the contract did not affect Mr.{jBarber's vote the result rhowed, but still he (Mr. Blake) folt it his duty to try and place it beyond the possibility 'of any leader of a Government in this Hanam +..." lity of any House from » I to influences" 86 9 E6n occasion 0n which tho Attor spoken to him about it It tion of dual represe?hbio'n, se o¢ "tha PE L* V o4 . %, the hon. leader of vexed at the ti into" bim 28 bet ent person. . _BHe | . + +9 in sn --fay eral or himidit uau IGIV ~AQ0O 00 000 34 for the incident. Atty.--Gen. MACDONALD sail the hon. member for South Bruce, while pretending to have the interests of the Houss at heart, was simply intermeddling with affaire which did not require his interference. The polit-- ical atmosphere of this country was too foul for the hon gentleman, and he was always endeavouring to purgo it. He was always wearying the Housa with speeches as long as a Mackinaw blanket (laughter) on subjects of no possible use to the country. He was wasting the time of the House, spreaiing himself to cat a figure before tha country, He sang the song, and his worthy colleagus, the hon. member for Bothwell, sang the chorus. (Laughter.) They claimed to be the purest aud the best, and charged everyons opposed to them with being corrupt and unfit to legis-- late for the country. He denounsed the policy of the hon. members opposits, which, he said, was to waste the valuable time of the House with buncombe measures and long buncombe speeches. Mr. PARDEE said if the hon, member for Bruce occupied the time of the House, he, at least, spoke senso, and advocated sound prin-- ciples _ This resolution was no buncombs measure. The principle embodied in it was sound, and should be supported by every hon. member who wished to maintain the independerce of the House. Hon. Mr. CAMERON said a law alrcady existed to prevent hon, members of the House from accepting contracts from Govern-- ment. Then what was the use of bringing _ up this _ resolution If it passed they could only affirm a principle already established. No, the ob-- ject of the hon. member opposite was to raize a cry at the next election. They wish-- ed to point to this vote and say, see how these Government supporters wish to sub-- vert the independence of Parliament He (Mr. C.) would therefore move that all alter the word ""that" in the resolution be struck out, and the following substituted :--* In the opinion of this House the indspsndencs of this House and the public interests are sufficiently protected by the Act to sscure ;.)llle independence of the Legislative Assem y. Mr. BLAKE said if the present law covered the case the hon. membor for Hal-- ton had committed a breach of the law, and bad no right to a sit in this House. But he (Mr. B.) did not consider that the Act ex-- tended far enough. The hon. members op-- posite seemed to think that the morality of giving a contract depended on the length o' time to which the contract extonded. It mattered not whether it was an isolatel bargain or a contract extending ocver years, Tho principle was the samse in each case, ard such a course was likely to subver's ths independence of members of this House,. Mr, CUMBERLAND would be sorry to think that the indopendence of Parliamsnt could be iniluenced by transactions outzide the House. He considered it aslur on every member in the House to insinuats such a thing. YEAS --Bealty, Boulter, Calvin, Cameron, Carling, (London), Carnegioe, Cockburn, Code, Colquhoun, Corby, cCraig (Glengarry) Craig (KRussellD), Cumber-- land, Currie, Grahame (York), Hays, Hoopor, Lauder, Lount, Lyon. _ Macdonald, Matchett, Moutcith. McCall (Norfolk), Read, Richards, Rykert, Scott (Grey), Secord, Smith flKunt). Smith (Leeds), Strange, Tett, Waillis, Wigle, Wilson, Wooi!i-- A division was taken on the amendmont, which was carried :-- Nays--Barber, -- Baxter. Blake. Boyd, Christie, Fveans, Fitzsimmons Fraser, Galbraith, Gow, Mc-- Kellar, McKim, McMurrich, Oliver, P irdee, Porry, sexton, Sinclair, Springer, Trow, Wiiliams (Mam-- ilton)--21, 81. Mr BLAKE thon moved the third rasolu-- tion. He said this resolution did not affect the independorce of the House directly, but it was calculated to afect it otherwigs. If constituencies were to be bribed to send sup porters of the Government by offers of local improvements, there was a danger of affect-- ing the independonce of Parliament. Ho re-- ferred to the speeches of the Attorney-- Goneral at Hamilton and at Brooklyn, (Here ho read extracts from the Attorney-- General's speech at the latter place ) But, besides these two speeches, other members in the House had mentioned the benefits which would be derived frem supporting the Gov-- ersment, If this were to be the course pur-- sued by the Administration of the day, then it was time for all honest men to let politics alone. In the case of the Bollevillo Asylam, overy report concerning it had shown that it was a reward to that constituency for the faithful support which its reprosentative had given the Government. No doubt the hon. gentleman had given a uniform support to the Government, and it was mainly for this reason that Belleville had received the Asy-- lum, andit was bocaase ilamilton had return-- ed an opponent to the Government that the public money had not been expanded there. The only argument advanced for establishing the Asylum at Belleville was that it was a central position. But it really was not a gentr:xl positon, Having rogard to population s l oi enc e n o ce w U ie rivcpow.... _ qUUDUlvu ETURE C CCC himsolf had more cause to ba sorry ',g was to the eastward, for thme-fourtm the population of Ontario were to the wa;t | and one fourth to the sast of that town ut | he did not wigh the discussion to descand ¢, the merits of the rival towns. The principle which he desired to establish was that the r site should have been chosen on its q3p | merits alome, not on account of the political | opinions existing in the locality. \ _ Mr. CORBY indignantly deniod the stats. | ment of the hon. member opposite that the members for Hastings had been influsaned l to support the Government by the catablish. | ment of the Asylum at Bsilevills, He quoted from TEx® GuoBE® a report of aspeech delivar. ed on the Sth November, in which this charge « was made, wher ho (Mr. Corby) was absent. He denisi that charge. lt was an utter jaisshood, The -- hon. members -- opporite -- wars always preaching about cconomical Govern. ment, and yet they were the most expan:ive material in the House. (Laughter) 'Tha hon. member for Bruce, and his worthy asso-- ciate the hon, member for Prescott, with their buncombe speeches, reminded him of Don Quixots and Sancho Panza attacking the windmill,. (Laughter) He would sst independently in spite of the howlings of ths hon, members opposite. He was elected to | give the Covernment an honest support, ani he would do it, His votes had been straight-- forward and honest. He had neverattssiked an hon. member opposite, but he woulid ro-- mind them if attacked himseli, ho would retaliato. (Applause). Hon. Mr. CAMERON said the few observations he had made in Bsile--| ville had given the honsurable memner . for _ South -- Bruse an _ opportuaisy | of making two or three speechos this seesion,. | The reason Hsmilton did not receive the Asy-- . Jum was that it was not a suitable site for is. | It was necessary to find #oms site, ard thae most central should be chosen. _ Bellcville was gelected for this reason, and it was naver intimated to the people of that section thas the Asylum was given them for past support, or as a bribe for futursaid. The hon. maam-- ber for Bruce had tried to prove that Balls-- ville was not central if poputation were to be considered, but he woulid remind the hoa member that the back country was beiag rapidly settled up, and before loag it would be the centre asregarded population as weli as ic position. He would request the hon momn bers opposite to find some fault of the Gov-- erpment to comp'!ain of, and not attack them for what thoey might possibly do in the fu-- ture. Mr. WILLIAMS (Hamilton) wished to krow why the Asyium was removed from Hamiiton ? Hon. Mr. CA MERON said it was basause Hamilton was fourd to be unheaithy and in mapy re:spects an unfit place for the Asylum. Belleville was selected bscause it wis a bet-- ter location in every respects. Mr. WILLIAMS sr:id the Asylum hai been removed from Toronto to Hamilton is the first place, because Hamilton was a beSter site for it. It could not be complained that a site could not be found for it there, because last session Lbe o#sremt fiity acres of laad fo: the purpoge. No, ths Asylim had not beeu removed {from _ HMamilton _ bocause it was not a dit place, but besause it did not return a supporter of the Govera-- ment to Parliamont. -- He considared it ons of the most disgraceful acts of which ary Gov-- erpment ever was or ever could be guiity. Mr. McCALL (Norfolk) supported the re-- solution, on the grousad that the removal of the Asylum bad been made for political rea-- BODg. Mr. FRASER knew of no act of the pre-- sent Administration which had met with suca usiversal condemunation as the removal of the Asylum from Hamilton. The country rs-- garded it not only as an act of injustice, but the wholo affair reflected great discradit on the Administration of the day. With re-- spect to the charge made against the houn. member for South _ Bruce, that hs wasted the time of the House with useless speeches on more theories, h: contended that the hon. _ momber was one of the most usc{ul in the Houss, and that ho was looked up to by the country a's large as a man of whom any couatry mighs be proud. Mr. SINCLAIR said the tendenoy of such speeches as those of the hon. Attorney--%an-- eral at Hamilton ard Brooklyn, and of tha Provincial Secrotary at Bellevilie, were cal-- culated to corrupt constituencies more than anything else. People should not tolorato such an insult as was offersd to the psople of Hamilton:by the hon. Attorney--General, sad the subsequent injury done the city bocause its representative refused to support the Government, He (Mr. S.) desired to sator his protest against such an unfair course as had been pursued by the Government in this, and he hoped the House would adopt thiis resolution and prevent a future recurrence of such disgraceful proceedings, Mr. COUKBURN said the hon. member for South Bruce had referred to him, and made a quotation from certain letters which wore written by him (Mr. Cockburn) during ths controversy with the press, last winter, when he had been unfairly charged with sordid motives in giving certain support to the Administration. The quotation mmade by the hon. member was correct, but was sur-- rounded by other observations, such as that he (Mr. Cockbura) had not been elected as an out--and--out opponent of the Government, which, he asserted, was bringing dowa many good and useful measures; that the country was progressing under the present rule, and that in consideration of all this, snd with the large and much--needed expenditures ro-- ferred to, he had been influenced in giving the Government the benefit of any doubt Heo always listened with interest to the ab'o speeches of the hon.member for South Bru0#; but he desired to be fairly represonted, and courted the fullest enquiry intoail his acts. Atty. --General MACDONALD said a groat deaal had C henun malln ant af his snsech at Atty. --General MACDONALD said a gramt deal had been made out of his sP%°%2 *' Brooklyn, but he would be bound to 27 was morse popular in that placo than any of the hon. gentlemen who condemned M The people did not approve of this attempt to make a member a blind follower Of °99 party. Now, respecting this Asy!"® he considered that when Government Wa$ °* trusted with $75,000, they should be allowed to say where it was to ke exponded. The hon. member for Hamilton had #50* mi':» 1= q8