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e TV AMKLAZV ERR ETE 00 uks Hon. C. F. FRASER rexplained that the ' Act provided for a mist .ke in the «ld Act, which / was not clear as to the place where plane of towns -- or villages should be filed. C The Bill was read the second time. THE RAINY RIVER ACT. Hon, 0. MOWAT said the Bill is one to give to the inhabitants of the western portion of the Province, now decided by the Privy Council to belong to Ontario,the benefit of local instiintcions, and the Aaministration of Justice Act. For the purpose of the Act the territory west of the old provisional line agre=d on for ceriain pi poses with the Dominion Government is takan, and the provisions of the Bill relating to the Thunder Bay district, while a territorial district, wore taken. Th e Bill provides for a rogistry office for doeds, a surrogate court, and registry office for a larzer ju--isdiction for the courts than exists there at present. 'These changes are desirable and neces* sary there, as the district would have had thom if the territory had been adjudged to belong to Manitoba,. _ When we set off the district from Thunder Bay we were anxious to find a uatural boundary between the district of Thunder Bay and Rainy River, but this, on consuitation with parties from the district, was found to bo im=-- possible, and no better line could be found than the provisional line agreed upon about ten years ago. The provisions of the Act of last session, agreeing for a reference to the Privy Council, expired on the judgment being made, but in consequence of the delay in informaition reaching there it is necessary that a date be niumed so that the acts of the Council may be legalized, as they continued to exercise their fnnctiona after the date of the judgment was legalized, as the functions after t! actualiy delivered. WAEREE Y TCO Sn e Mr. MEREDILTH--When did the provisional council esase to act? Hon. O. MOWAT--On the 24th October, Mr. MEREDITH--W hat is now done ? Hon. 0. MOWAT--The provisions of the Bill say that the old Council should revive, so that the old Board realiy rovived when the Order in Council was made. W STCT _ ..% avm> u5 RIE 2 WURPUIPWRC M TD Mr. MEREDITH--In point of fact, did the old Council resume its duties ? Hon. 0. MOW AT--Yes. Mr. MEREDITH--On the 24th October * Hon. 0. MOWA'T--Yes. Mr. MEREDITH--Wanat officers will be re-- quired under the Act ? o s L p-- 2 20 ie» m a m ols ue id e t s ROu® C ' Hon. 0. MOWAT--A registrar of deeds, a surrogate court clerk, who will also be deputy= clerk for the purpose of issuing writs. . I have not provided for a sheriff, but it on further cons sideration I had it is needful, I shall ask the House to do so. _ _ e--w+se uuring the last year, 'The -- _ DOoMIXIOX coverxiueyr asked in their estimates last year for $648,900 : they have expendod $662,7 expenditure exceeded their estimatea For Geological Survey they asked $( expended $115,929, or their expenditur their estimate by $55,929. For the ] partment they asked 8779 ¢)) .. ; _ Mr. MEREDITH----Is there auy definite in-- formation as to the population other than the floating population in this district? _ THE BUDGET, ' Mr, MoLAUGHLIN was warmly applauded | on rising to resume the debate on the Budget. It | was not, he said, his intention to detain the ' House at auy great length, for two reasons-- | first, because the Treasurer in making his state-- | ment made it with the same fuiness and ability which characterized his address last year ; _ and secondly, because his hon. friend from North Grey (Mr. Creighton) in replying made an attack upon the finances of the Provinco which was very mild and required fow romarks, In the first place he regretted that the questions botween the Provinces--and the Province of Ontamo particu-- larly--had not been settled. Wel!, they regretted that, but he would like the House to remamber where the faulit lay. | The Provincial Treasuror of Ontario went down to Ottawa last year, where he was met by the Treasurer of Quebec and Sir ; Leonard Tilley, to make an cffors to settle thos matters, but they were balised in the first step oi their progress by Sir Leonard Tulley saying that | be could not go on without the presencs of Sir Jolhin Macdonald, that if progress had not been | made, let the fmult be placsd at the do»r of thoso | who were to bilame. 'Then his hon, friend had made a great ontery because the estimate. have I been very much exceeded by the expeaditure. He was willing to admit that it was well ior the | Government tomake estimutes which would more than -- cover their expenditure, -- but there were times whon it was not possibl o to _do this. It it _ was wrong -- for the Government of this Province to exceed their estimates in their expanditure, it was surely wrong tor others to do the #same th ng. He asked the attention of the House to the management by the Dominion Government of their financial affairs during the last year. The floating po%ll:\hon in this Gisumctl __| Hon, 0. MOWAT--O{ course therae is no cer-- tain information. --Hon. 0. MOWAT--For long distances the country is vory «parsely populated. _ Hon. C. F. FRASER--The army of occupation is gone. fiLanghter). The Bill was read the second time. _Mr. MEREDITH--There aro no poliing places for long distances? _ o es f To AMEND THE REGISTRY ACT, C hedeitetn ave expended $662.767, or thair eded their estimatea by $13,867, jurvey they asked $60,000, ans '0, or their expenditure exceeded ¥ $55,929. For the Militia D. asked $779,8609 and expended Rill is one to give ern portion of the ie Privy Council to of local instiiutions, istice Act.: For the tory west of the old 'or ceriain piuposes o to exceed their °, it was surely : thiug. He asked the management of their financial for legislation Eeseeeeeeeeeeeeeeii 0C $989,498, or exceeded their estimate by #20).°. 898, For Public Works they asked §2,447,940 and expended $2,998,851, an excoss over their estimaie of $460,911. Mr. MEREDLLH--Does that list include the sugplemontary ectimates ? Ar. McLAUsHLIN--IL think #o. At all events I wiil give tho total excess, including sup= piementary ostimates. -- For Miscellanoous they asked $1914,950 and spout $336,070, an excass of| §141,720 ; for Indian Grants they asked $875,919 and expended $1 116,158, and exceeded their &nd eXPSDC oa(@ 909 + tor the Mounted Police! tm e us mt ocach uen t 0 asked $1914,950 and spout $336,0670, an exc""3 O winagy Mini §$141,720 ; for Indian Grants they asked $875,919 What Minis and expended $1 116,158, and exceeded_their| be rcgmr'edi estimage by $240,209 ; tor the Mounted | Police| Y°5¥4 ' But they exceeded their estimats by $69,0°3 : in the| ceeded, at | Customs Departmont the excoss was £60,0983 ; in} Department the Excise $15,137, and in the Postoffice $74,655;) 82 thiat t or taking the whole ostimatss--supplement r¥| Then there and ali--the Government a«tz «4o for $29,9861,989, demand for and they expanded §31,107, 70( anidd theift mark would expcnditure over their estimates wos 81,145,717. about the ad g':"h hear.) _ 1e was not quoting | these | had people ures to jastily an exceoss of the »xpenditnres | far imore C over the estimates by the Provincial Government, | other time. | bus in ordcr to show that it there was an exces had gone to at nere VIU "". [ noy. | ing the amo )8S, For ENONC /" U ues oJ avanuk GVer Lthel id expended $2,998,851, an excoss over 8i ppowy apporred _ £9 be an OverAbApPemnt!"" timate of $160,911, ut i of $10,000. _ There were soMm® matters in conneC® Mr. M EREDI'I;H--:D«:.: that list include the ou with the Education D spartment which m:u?:; upplementary ectimales * A it d fhicul 'mate what the expsnditure wou. R"' MeLAUs HLIN--L think 80. .. At all ll:ud fnlliuwtmtx(l.: 'lt)lamu:torlv impoulglo for the Pro= vents I wiil give the total excest, including S0D° y;/ o;4! Preasurer to dctermine an increased de-- iement<ry ostimates. . For Miscellanoous th6Y) "0 // q uon the sup>rannuation fund of £3,000. se 1st td P tan $s o in Mad $875. 19 '{'Vamt ll\?iniflter could see what increase would 141,720 ; for Indian Grants they asked $875,949 be required for Depa 'tmental examinations this nd expended $1 116,158, and exceeded lhglrl car?t But although the estimate had been ex-- stimage by $240,209 ; tor the Mounted Volicd] Zoede'd at the same time the income from the hey exceeded their estimats by §69,983 : in the S Mr¥m.ongt had been very much increased also, lustoms Departmont the excoss was $60,083 ; in| 1P8P it "le one would balance the other. he Excorse $15,137, and in the Postoffice $74,655; "]t"l L' ore Thrat_'bees san iergase i% cithe r taking the whole oshmnfn-»---up_pln-un:nL~r:vl a l::md 'f:)r c'hurity whd" hospitals, and the re-- o e Pntided "S "'-'f o 0d m o wl n:\rk would apply here again which be had made id exmn:lm) §31,107, 704 s1 1 s ""* | about the adminstration of justice. When we ?{m"dlmh.' .ovcrf[hew.(s:""'":j P "f"" hu' t bhad people out of employment there would be Eum t '""M';)sr : e:«:"'u x:f, u;'.iu.-'x",:,i,_m,:;'.é:i far more demands in this dircction than at an> o n e on it Con b i d other time. -- Then thero were other items which ver the estimates by the Provincial Government, | pout ds swell-- ; A /a,4,4 had gone to & consideravle extent towards we bus in ordcr to show that it there was an ©x008« iug the amount expended . over ind above the oi expenditare is was wrong there &« wa 38 4O TD mates, We found that a note WASs taken for an 1 "'i; it cou'd ;lOLtmur ?l':zlv:'::ewz;'l(l l?':;::'j'\ ©10,000, in comnection with the disputed terri-- here. at wiaile he tnougut + ; bamagt + ; sible, to keep the estimates within the expendi-- t9ry» lzut. it had cost very much more than that turs, he did not regard tho «r »at question as be-- "'\';""'G EREDITH--That was not last year ing whether th«y have boaen exceede 4, but whether }\Ir ® \l"L:'\l'GULlV---It es soing on .lut one dellar has bsen cx;tfnvlod by this Governinent veurr. mMC * * & during the pu.ye'xrwx.ch was not nocessary. "~." inp _Thi x la lsoking over these excessive txpv.mlntfuras he km%\tlflr. MEREDITH--This was expended in law ound thui the cost of the awdininistrat.on of justice * i vA + j a i2 TS71 was $182,021, while in 1884 it was$331,027, Mr. *F'Uw\ul'f}fel-\t ;'f-t'::fl'::; m * * an increas> of $1143,406, In regard to this item it d""""""","';""?"' vyes "il Tt U y« would o was very diftrsult u; determine what the expaul'h- "'""""c'; 't'l;":',:i":e"io?'"; fi:: o':';: C ay DCiBL ture §woula be. HMe took --this »greund, that aemue y HAAY NMHWR ( o the exponse depended very largely guu the times. h;«tcl_xed out in their interest by a brawling brlol(:_d 1i the times were good there was less crime than of bribers, aud that had cost '-ble countoy $8,111. if they wore bad, because people had less oppor-- Hoe wou d not detain the louse longer !! tuaity to get into inischief, He thought a com-- re{erring _ to those items, but he wou.c_ parison of the cost of the administration _ of | 83¥ that before hon. _ gentiemen _ coul ju--tice in different years would establish this | PYOY® that the Government wgre'qxlnvunnt point. In 1877, when wo wers entoring on w thoy must take up these items individually, an« period of deprossion, we found that the expendi«-- point out some of them that were unnecessar bura was $277,302. One ye.r later, in 1878, and uncailed fc'sr in the efisient management o which was perhaps the worst period of that com« | the country. The hon. rmember for North Gre mercial erisis, we tfound that it had gone up t» (Mr. Creighton) had ch'nmed that if this Govern $285,360. Bat in 1879 the deprossion began to ment had gove on with tha e:gpe:_:dnture in l'.l pa--saway, and wo found the expenditure then 54M° ratio as the Jolin Sandfield Macdonal 8274 013 --much less than in the previous ye«r. Government they would have _'1'""'3_"0 this Pr In 1880 the times were much better, and we vince in the last ten years $6,850,000. _ found the expenditaure $265,070. In 1881 it Mr. CREIGHTON--No. _I was giving the: went down fto $251,119; in 1882 there was a credit for what they had done. | slight increase to $252,731, and awain in 1883 to Air. McLAUGHLIN--The sum of his arg \$275,211; and last your, which was the worst we mont was that the Governmment would have be | had had for a long time, we found the expendi-- $6,850 000 richer and the people that mu« the eXpeDILF ) ""C) 0 ho noliev of this Government WAS and colomzstion romis,. _ We found an over i in Crown Lands of $36,000, and in expend:turo in Crow n o-':n':'_ he? ail -- Knew colonizatron wanl; O(fi 3'-";')-0- ;"m'bo.um in ; there 13 con tli':' North--West -- for -- soma years past, but that last year f.lmt;l b)fom _wnn 1:;:9;}:3':;;':('; immigrants instead of going 1 , 3:::'1:"«'»1? h:.he good agricultural soil of Ontarmf and tha Governnent hu:l to push the nnrvely o new townships. In this one item alone there ha i boeen a great increase in the cxp-.'mm.ur? over what was expected--$21,000--but there was l".° one who would blame the l,'ovarnmeng for t H«j expenditure, We all knew that glxls.lnerou(i) scttlement tneant increased colonization roam f' and therefore we found an increaso in that item, but not #so much as would appear. The increase over the estimates would appear to be $20,000, but he believed oneshaif of that was paid on roads previously built. Mr, MEREDITH --iIn 1883 ? Mr, MobhAUGHLIN--Yes, in 1883. _ He wished to refer to another matter to which he had referred to tefore, lMon. friends opposite were in the habit of stating that thare was always an in-- creaso in colonization ronds during any year in which a parliamentary election occurred, either l for the Dominion House or this one. -- Ho bhad taken the trouble to make up a I statemeont of _ the expenditures _ for seven years in which elections l were held, and for six years in which no elections | were held, and he asked "the attention of the | MHouse to these fixares. Tho expenditures during | the olection years were as follows :--1872, $750,% T9PMO ; _ 1874, +890,762 43 ; is75, $103,511 89 ; 1878, 8$85,612 48 ; 1879, $114,564 13 ; 1882, $110,~ 650 ; 1883, $123,407 47 ; or a total of $704,397 59, and an average yearly expenditure of £100, 728 22, Taking the next item, years in which there ware no elections, they found the following expenditures :----In _ 1873, $145,950 ; 1876, £85,031 43 ; 1877. _ $77,300 ; 1880, _ $96,. 530 990 ; 1881, $07,280 80 ; 1834, $1985,779 55. or an average of $114,847 29, which was a greator av--raze than during the yoars when elections wore held. (Hoear, hear, and appiause.) In re-- gard to this over--expenditure, it was porfectly justifiable, and more than this, if the hon. gen~ tleman who leads the Opposition had had con-- tral, nccording to the stories he was tolling up North last vear, it would have been $200,000 instead of $155,050, so that certainly he had no right to complain if the estimatas hard ham»m a2 .. 62 M CROWN LANDS wfllh is with'stendiiticntntie d :12 T0 .O estimates bad been exceeded in 114,847 20, which was a greator ing the yoars when elections , hear, and appiause.) In re-- ~expenditure, it was porfectly mWB kh aw aqrE 0 8 4y s 0#7,706 _ and therr ates was §$1,145,717. ' not quoting -- these of the »expenditnres | thut'respeéh In theroe appeured to of $10,000, _ There v tion with the FEAucat it d flicult to es'timnu COMPARISON OoF THE cost of civil government and legis'atton between the years 1871 and 1884, he said it was time that it had increased, but not beyond the volums of work done then in _ comparison with that 17 EOE TT THY PCPE oPt TT NTE RAAEC done now, _ In 1871 there were 43 sessional clerks, while in 1884 there were 96, winch was more than twice as many as in 1871 and his hon.friend from London (Mr. Moredith) and hs friends ware re«ponsible for this increasa by romson of their many motions for returns, Then it would be remeoinrbered that in 1873 there was an incress, made in the s Aarios of civicfervants,in which the hou, memberdfar L oudon concarred. In conuse--tioa with civu governmen . in 1871 we had two inspec. tors of pusous and asyluins, but now there was added to these an inspector of rogistry offices and an inspector of insurance companies. In making EDUCATION over--erponditure | T6 hk B "w §3% dhig