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Mr. BALFOUR criticized the statement of the P hon, member for West Toronto when that gentle-- iman stated to the Mouse that it would be ot no ! use to discuss the accounts of the Province which C had been submitted to the House, as thess ac-- v counts could not be depended upon. That gen-- e tlemim had furtber stated that the Commissioner } of Crown Lands had told the members of the House that the proper way was to trke the re-- t ports o the various Departments,compare them t with the pubjie accounts, and thereby arrive at ® a decision,. Thae Hon. Commissioner for Crown ® Liinds bad said nothing of the kind. (Hear, 1 hear.) Cartain items of expenditure in his De-- + partment had not been charged up in the accounts ® tor the year, and the Commissioner had stated * that they could get it by reterence to his Depart« / ment, but this occurred only in the Crown ! Lands Department HMs (Mr. Baifour) be-- t lisved a most favourable statement _ of ,! the accounts had been presented by the Pro-- vincial _ 'Treasurer,. _ HMa _ could emphasize the position whichithe Treasurer bad taken in regard «o the Radlway Aid quesstion. He was sure the 'Freasurer's position was the true aud corract one. M believed that, as the 1D»-- minion Government had assumed control of the Provincial railroads, that Government should re--pay the bonuses and subsidiecs granted. Some peopis obj ,-«'Rd to their taking aud from the Dominion, bad been stated that it was not a proper course for the dominion to subsidize the vartous Provincos, Mo quoted the following, which showed the pos tion The Monetary Times had taken in reference to the matter :-- to watch the way in which the exsenditnr: for colonization roads went up and down, ac-- cording as the elections came on. (Hear, hear.) --It was extraordinary,. Was there not some substantial reason beyond that given by lihcs Ee less o ol ho k msk 9 i "The tendency to increasc"the Provincial sub-- Sklies presenis one of the greatest perils to which the Federal finances are exoosed. . Manitoba, which was undoubiedly in an exceptional posi-- tion, has got promise of another incresse, and Nova seotia is knocking at the treasury door with ali the vizour of the comvbined strength of the two political parties, which have here found a common ground of agreement, If the batance is seriously disturbed in one direction, the necessity of redres-- sing it in others will greatly increase the danger to the Federal tinances." Me had no «doubt but cvery #member of the Mouse subscribed to the position taken by that papsr. _ If the subsidiecs to the other Provinces woere incraased, however, he thought they shou:d not stand by without emphasizing their right to be treated the same as the other Provinces. This was the position taken by the Provincial Troas« vrer in regard to the matter, -- However, the hon. loader of the Opposition had, in a speech at London, Sstated <that The believed the,interesss of the wholo Dominion wore more to be con-- sidered than the interests of the ¥rovinces. He (Mr. Balfour) supposed they would tind the hon. gontleman acting in that way in regurd to their demands in this respect. Me only hoped the hon, gentleman would be found supporting the Giovernment in their right demands of the Do-- mimion of Canad «. (HMear, hear.) Notwithstand-- ing if they could not take the railway liabnlity as a present liamlity they now hbad more to pay off their liability, and had a larger surplus than at this time last year. (Hear, hear.) He would refer to just one or two item: in cons nection with expenditure. They found that the Dominion Government for legislation in 1871 spout $356,2005, while in 1883--4 the expenditure under this hoad was $662,767, almost double what ces s e o e o en eeney anvvu L the hon. gentlieman? Did hon. genf.leme: believe the reasons given? He did not think so. 'The total over--expenditure under this head was $144,272. The Commissioner of Crown Lands said that almost anything could be proved by figures. The hon. gentie-- man was an expert at that. (Hear, hear.) They had given money back to the people. That was true. They had bribed the people with their own money, If they had a sur-- plus of $6,000,000 that surpius ought to be earning somethicg for the people. ¥Yet the earnings on their investments ammounted to the beggarly sum of $57,521. If they nad such a surpilus why not pay off the railway serip ? (HMear, hear.) If they had the means of pay-- ing off this scrip now they could save $3,-- 069,425, 'They should conduct the affairs of the province as a business man would conduct his own business, No merchant would con-- duct his business in the same way as the financial aflairs of the proviuce were being conducted by the Government, it was ten years ago. | For civil government they found that the expanditure had increased from $542,000 in 1871 to $1,034,000 in 1883. They found tivs to be a progressive increase, as was not the cas> in the Province, The Provincial Government had not gone on increasing their expenses for legislation and forcivil government, but the cost hadt beon about on an avorage, taking the exponditure for the past two or throee years, 'Then they found the total expenditursof the consolidated fund oi $15,600,000 increased to $81,107,000 in 1883--.4, besides large sums which $81,107,000 in 1883.4, besides large sums which had beeu charged to capital account. _ By refer= ring to the Budget they found that civil govern. ment demanded the usual incroase. _ This in-- crease h--d grown with the country, Tuse hon. members opposite thought it right for the Do« minion to incre.se these expenditures by very interesting large amounts, 'They found no fau t with this at all, bus with Provincial affairs all was differs ent, The hon. mempber for North Grey had stated that ho foresaw depression shadowint posterity as far as the Province was concerned, but he did not scem to be crushedl by the present depression of the Dominion Government. (Hear, hear.) He supposed that gentloman woulid be ¢rying out in agony about the burdens isid on future gonerations. e had not seemed to have been able to realize that yot. _ Mr. Baifour also referred to the liabili.ies of the Province of Que-- bec, and discnssed an exploded charge which had fallen from the lips of the member for West Peterborough. -- The hon. member had tried to make out that the deficit this year was over $700,000, Tho speaker thought, that according to the calcu'lations of the hon. member, there might as well have been a deficit of a million dol-- lars. -- It had also been stated that the Mowat Government maintained the public buildings which bad been oreected by the Johnn Sand-- field Macdonald Governinent. Now, he found that that Government had spent £971,000 on publicbuildines, while the Mowat Government had spent $2,700 for public buildings, in ad-- dition to maintaining the different institutions. That statement, therofore, had not been borne out by the facts. Hon,. mcembers when speaking on the Budget had claimed that the Ontario Government had no right to pay Hon, Bdword Biake or Hon. Davia Miils }or duties poeriormed. _ The speaker asked how about some memvers of the Opposition who had received money for thois services from the Dominien Government,. -- He (Mr. Balfour) did not think those genticmon opposite had over sus'iained any charge of improper expenditure which they CHRAER mE (T% PRRIPIOIQZE OOA PPEIDOIRICEE HERATCIR NCP had laid against the Government. . They had been unable to do so. They _ found the _ hor. -- memboer _ for -- Woest _ Toronto talking about the great exponditure of the Gove ermpent and at the samo time urging the Gov-- ernment to go on with the erection of new Par-- liament Baildings at Toronto, Their surplus, be thought, would ins: tor thirty yours, Itwasnotsuch a gloomy out ook for posterity so far as Ontario as a Province was concerned. -- Bstore the Public Accounts Cominiiteo the Opposition had been unable to unearth what effectod the standing of the Government, as far as the confidencs of the people was« concerned, (Applause ) Mr, MERRICK complained of the House being cailed upon to wait for departmental re-- ports before eriticizing the pubiic expenditure, particulars of which should be found in the public accounts, Year atter year, when the appropriations were Oo¥verdrawn, they were treatea to excuses just such as the Commis-- sioner presented to them. (Hear, hear.) It was seldom that the House saw the report of the Commissioner of Grown Lands before near the end of the session. _ Year by year they had gone over the public accounts, assuming that they were correct, but 1t now seemed that their oriticisms were of little vaiue, _ But aiter the elections they returned to the House, and were tola that there was an over--ex penditure, wuich, however, had been carried over to the next year. Now the Commissioner said this was all wrong, and they wouid have to ref>r to departmental tigures before reaching any conclussons, They aui not object to a reasonable sum being spent on these roads, but they objected to the varying sums of $80,000 in one year and $120,000 in another. It was claimed that the present Government haa spent during their thirteen years more than Nandtield Macdonald nad spent during his four years of power. Of course, but the only fair comparison was one of annual rate of expenditure and the average, and he gave the tigures which proved an excess of annual expenditure by sandficld Macdonaid over that of the present Government on account of public buildings of $34,000, Colonization ro .ds showed a different resuit, but in regvard to Publhec Works there was a sum of $38,00) in favour of ~andfiecld Macdonaid annuaily and taking the average instead of the aggre-- gate, No that respecting these three import-- ant items together, they found that the Gov-- ernment w=ich preceded the present one spent morereally than the one now in power. Inesti-- mating the surplus they had to judge the (Government by its own acts, And what was the result? Taking the cash surplus of $3,810,000, and adding the $2,848,000, they had very nearly the whole of the surpius claimed. _ So far as their own savings were concerned the Government were entitled to no credit for the surplus,. Hon, gentiemen opposite had received $2,883,633 more tnan the six miliions odd which they had given back to tne peopie. As to the railway an-- nuities, he hoped that the Government wouid take the advice of the member for East Middlesex (Mr. Waters), and either take a suflicient sum from the treasury to meet the liability or issue debentures and take up these annuitiee at once. He pointed out that the Commissioner of Crown Lavds, in stating that the Treasucer had not said that in a short time they would have to resort to direct taxation unless they INDP°' aled to the Deminion Treasury, was in-- | f m.ol;, for he was of opinmion that the Trea surer did so state. (Hear, hear.) What were they coming to? The Governmenrt had held $550,000 from year to year, and were probably reserving it to the time whan the leader of the Opposition would permit the Government to erect new -- Parliament buildings. (Hear, hear.) They found the Government in the position of refraining from doing what they thought their duty, and erecting those build-- ings for fear of the Opposition. (Hear, hear.) He hoped that in future they would have | public accounts upon which they could rely. | (Applause.) Roke, s Mr, MEREDITH was surprised at the position the Commissioner of Crown Lands took. The hon. Commussioner posed before the House as a candid man. The Commis-- sioner recognized the integrity of particular members of the House, and was always ap-- pealing to particuiar members of the House for the purpose of flattering them in the vain hope of catching a vote here and there, but to borrow an illustration, he might find, like the heathen Chinee, a couple of right bowers u(? the sleeve of the hon. gentieman. (Cheers.) The hon. Commissioner complained of unfairness when attacks were madF:a upon him, but he charged the members of the great Conservative party with entering into a ase conspiracy to plunder the people of this country, When the hon.{gentleman wanted to make such charges he should not be so ten-- der about charges being made against him-- self. The hon. gentleman said they were not able to poist to _ any expenditure they could attack. He was particular about any attack on the expenditure for col-- onization roads. and he put up as a defender of his administration a gentieman to under-- | take to prove that there had not been excep-- tional expenditure on colonization roads in election years, who actuaily made the spectacle of declaring in one breath that there was money expended in 1883 charged to 1884 in the public accounts for one purpose, and then turning _ round and using the . same as developing no such argument. . (Cheers.) In 1881 the expenditure was . $97,289 for the hon. gentleman's department. -- In 1882 it was $110,650, and in 1883, when the | hon. gentlemen went appealing to the country ' to return them, they ran the expenditure up | to $150,497. (Cheers.) They preached | patriotism in one breath and put their hands . into the public treasury for the purpose of debauching the constituencies with the . other. _ He had _ authority to spend $17,000 in Aigoma, and then when an election was pending, without the authority of Parliament expended another $17,000. (Hear, hear.) The Treasurer made the announcement tnat he had got $2,800,000 added to the surplus of the province, . The hon. gentieman was so driven that he had to join hands with the Province of Quebec to obtain $2,800,000 from the Dominion trea-- sury, money that was obtained by the sacri-- fiee of two and a half nullions of money belonging to the peopie of Ontario. In 1872, when the budget speech of Mr, Mackenzie's Government was made, the position then taken was that from two--thirds to three-- fourths of the revenue was contributed by the people of Ontario, and only the other day the Commissioner of Crown Lands gave as an excuse to a deputation for not grant-- ing aid to a railway that three--fifths of the money that went into the exchequer of the Dominion of Canada was contributed by the people of Ontario. By virtue of the con-- tention which, for the purpose of claiming $2,800,000 as part of the surplus of Ontarmio, the hon,. gentlemen joined hands with the Province of Quebec in endeavouring to force upon the Dominion Government a construction of the Tiliey Act of 1873 which was foreign to the spirit of the Act--(cheers)--by means of that construction of the Act $7,172,2907.92 was adued to the debt of the Dominion. He -- called to witness the evidence of the Commissioner of Crown Lands that three out of five dollars were con-- tributed by Ontario. The Treasurer was Tesponsible for this, because by joining hands with Quebec he made it impossible tor the Dominion Government not to yield to that demand, (Cheers:) _ = _ _ _ > *« -- Hon. Mr. HARDY--Do not make us re-- eponsible for the Dominion's crimes, _ _ _ Mr. MEREDITH--No, you have enough of your own. (Laughter and appiause.) The hon. gentieman waxed dogmatic when refer-- ence was made to the wisé and careful expen-- diture of Mr. Sandfield Macdonald, but there --Hon. Mr. ROSS (Huron)--I would ask how many demands the .Dominion Govern-- meut have not acceded to ? F _ Mr. MEREDITH--We are at this one de-- mand now.