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1 _ Mr. Drury--I spoke in regard to | correspondence. ' Some Members--No, no. \__ Mr. Hicks--If there is anything I \ dislike it is a man who hedges. If | there is any credit due a man let 'that man have his credit. and if '"'Whether necessary or not," he said, "I gave my undertaking that I would not divulge any secrets or l anything that I should not--any | matters that I held as Government | Whip. For what reason I am at a loss to know, the following evening in this House the Prime Minister deliberately--I was not in my place ----challenged me to produce any-- thing. From reports I have had and conversations with members in the House, he invited every confidence." Mr. Hicks--I think T said I would not uge any correspondence or any matter of any secrecy. That I con-- sidered to be my duty, whether the Prime Minister wished to further amaw out the controveray-- The Prime Minister was aliso placed in an embarrassing position when Mr. Hicks revealed the fact that Mr. Drury suspected --W. H. Casselman, U.F.0, member for Dun. das, of leaking party secrets. Mr. Hicks declared the Premier had withheld. a caucus notice from Mr. Casselman because "there is a lealt somewhere in our caucus; I don't kmow whether I can trust this man Casselman." _ Mr. Hicks began by referring to & newspaper article of April 12. Mr. Drury -- I understood the member to say when he made his first statement that he had corre-- spondence in hand. I was quite will-- ing to lhmave any correspondence published. Mr. Dewart--Conversations, too. Mr. Drury----I don't remember that, but correspondence; and I have had no correspondence with the.member that might not see the light of day. Sparks fiew again in the Legis-- lature yesterday -- when Andrew Hicks, erstwhile Whip of the U.F.O. Government, returned to the attack on Premier Drury. He insinuated the Premier was suffering from "loss of memory" with respect to painful in-- cidents recently ventilated, and, in spite of emphatic denials by Mr. Drury and his followers, again re-- iterated that the Prime Minister had seriously contemplated deserting the Farmers' party to jJoin the Macken-- zie King Cabinct at Ottawa. He offered to produce members of the U.F.O. group who would substan-- tiate his story that the Premier had sought leave of the caucus to relin-- quish office in Ontario. Ex--Whip Stands by Guns and Reiterates Drury Contem-- plated Deserting U.F.0. SPARKS FLY IN HOUSE MEMBER FOR DUNDAS SUSPECTED BY DRURY OF LEAKING SECRETS Dislikes Man Who Hedges. Hicks Tells How Premier Withheld Caucus Notice From Casselman Mr. Drury--I don't wish to answer people who are so irresponsible and so lost to sense, not of their obliga-- tions to me personally, but of their there is discredit due let. that man accéept it. Any person might make a slight mistake in statement, but when it comes to hedging I don't think it becomes a public man, especially one of the first men of the Province. After all the differences of opinion the Prime Minister and myself have had during the past few weeks, I would like if there would be some place that we could reach on common ground, and agree on some minor particulars. Perhaps . we could reach some place and see alike for at least a minute. In the mat-- ter of <calling caucuses, when the House was not in session, the usual practice was that the Prime Minis-- ter called me on long--distance tele-- phone and said he would like a caucus on a certain date, if that date was satisfactory, which was always satisfactory to me, as a matter of serving my leader. When the date was set the Prime Minister would instruct his secretary to send out the notices with my name attached. That was the usual practice? Mr. Hicks--Well, I am glad we agree. While there is lifo there is hope. I have a newspaper article here referring to a certain caucus held. Just the particular date seems to be a matter under discus-- sion. However, we won't pursue that matter at present, but suffice it to say that caucus was called, and, when the Prime Minister called me at my home and asked if that was the date, I said it was, and a caucus was called. Some two or three days after I was recalled on the tele-- phone by the Prime Minister, and he said this: "Say, Hicks, I didn't send a notice to Mr. Casselman." . I said, '"'Is that so?" He said, '"No, I didn't send him a notice." I said, '"Why, Mr. DPrury?'"' '"'Well,'" hesaid, *"I have always felt that there is a leak somewhere in our caucus; I don't just know whether I can trust this man Casselman." I said, '"Well, Mr. Drury, I don't know any reason why Mr. Casselman should not receive a notice cfor this caucus; he (is a Government member, and as long as I am Government Whip Mr. Casselman will have to receive his notices the same as other members.'"' When that caucus assembled, one of the first questions asked by the member for Dundas was this: '"'Why was my notice dated some two or three days later than the others?'" Now I think, Mr. Premier, I am quoting the facts correctly. Terrible Loss of Memory. Mr., Hicks--To join the King Cab-- Inet. As a matter of fact, the Prime Minister has denied everything I sald -- everything. He has denied this fact. Now, that caucus existed, and if the Prime Minister denies it . today on the: floor of the House' there are members here who art; willing to substantiate what I have| sald--that that caucus took place. ' Mr. Hicks--The conclusion of the caucus was this:© The Prime Minis-- ter sd@id: '"For loyalty: and support shown me, for the help and loyalty receilved, I will not leave you at the present timse, but I will stay with you until after the next election, and in the meantime I desire that noth® ing will be placed in my way that would hinder me from making that move, whereby I could go any timeée without, questions being asked.'"' /[I sey that there are Government mem-- bers here who, even at that time, took the matter up with their> Ex-- ecutives when they went home, and discussed it to this extent, ~that the Prime Minister had asked to go to Ottawa. x ' Mr. Drury--Yes. -- Doubtful About Casselman. Mr. Hicks--That is the great trou-- ble. Loss of memory is a terrible} thing. But that did occur, and on' this particular occasion you did not| wish the member for Dundas at the| caucus, the particular date on which | this discussion took place. Now, in : fact, the article appearing in the! paper is as I reported--that at this particular caucus the Prime Minis--| ter laid this matter before its mem-- bers, and said that he wished to go: to Ottawa, and the matter was dis-- cussed, and after the Prime Minis-- ter had laid before the Government members his wish to go to Ottawa the Government members at once said that they could not think of it, would not allow it. Mr. Dewart--What does the mem-- ter understand by the suggestion that he go to Ottawa? » Mr. Dewart--Couldn't he take the train ? f Mr. Drury--I don't remember any-- thing about that. E. J. Evans (South Simeoe)--I for one member object to the Prime Minister being foolish enough to te}j what has gone on in caucus. If one man who has 'been in caucus and pledged his word to respect it has such little respect for himself that het gets up like a contemptible rat--. Members--Order! Ordert Mr. Hicks--Mr. Speaker, I am per. fectly satisfied that the honorab!e'{ member should use language he chooses. Ijust want to reaffirm here what I said to the Press: that this caucus took place. The matter I referred to transpired.><The Prime Minister does not dery it, although on the evening of April> 26 (Thurs-- day) he lhastily summoned some of the men whom he thought would be able to come to his rescue. I believe the following members were sum-- moned to deny everything I had said, and I don't 'believe thit they wore unanimous in denying everything I said. I think that there were mem-- bers there who said 1 correctly re.-- ported that caucus, and my opinion is that the members who attended that hurried conference and issued a Press denial were Messrs. Oke, MacVicar, Lethbridge, -- Freeborn, Taylor, J. B. Johnston, 'Widdifield, Evans and the Premier himself, and certain two gentlemen signed a de-- nilal of everything, and I want to say in signing the blanket denial of everything they signed what they knew was not correct in one par-- ticular--the caucus did exist. So far as that caucus goes that is all T have to say on it. f % Not False, Says Taylor. , t y 1 o 5 . 7 t N HAH FAUTORN is not at all in accordance with the matter, Mr. Hicks--If it is not in accord. ance with all the facts, J would like the Prime Minister to say that it never occurred. I would Just like to get some common ground. Fither it didn't occur or it did vecur., I have tried to convey to the public exactly what you tried to convey to members of the caucus at that time, Now I think there are other mem-- bers of the House that had the same impression of that caucus as L "A contemptible Rat--,." Mr.: Casselman--I am annoyed that my name S! been dragged into this u discussion. I want to say if the Prime Minister at accused me of "leaking"> Mr. Drury--But I woula [ the version given of that cau the member for South Huron at all in accordance with the : obligations to their fellow. and to their word of hono?e:'nb;m must say I apologize for my ; 1 picions of the member for Dufl'dus' infiievé:t '}]\13 presént positlon &s. r, Casseiman--I shoul. ik'¥ ought to. uld think you D. J. Taylor (U.F.O., North Grey) --The member for South Huron has connected my name with this sub-- committee. Apparently he means the committee that met the Premier on the occasion the alleged state-- ment as reported by him a week ago was made. He states that we sign-- ed the denial, knowing it to be false. I signed that denial. of the alleged statement of the member for South Huron feeling that in no way could the conversation that was carrled on between this committee and the Premier on this particular occasion be interpreted to mean anything like the statement he gave the Press. Some weeks previous to this statement given the Press by the member-- for South Huron a com-- mittee asked the Prime Minister for a private conversation, which was held: in the office of the Premier. This committee was appointed: by & caucus of the whole Government for the purpose® of discussing matters and policies that might be carried on prior to the coming election. What went on in detail it would be & violation of my pledge of secrecy to divulge. I cannot go farther than to tell this House that the--in-- terpretation and the alleged staté-- ments by the member for South Huron could in no way be taken from the conversation that was carried on in 'the caucus to mean anything like the statements he gave to the Press. For that reason I felt quite justified in signing the denial. The member has been a personal friend of mine ever since he came to this House. He was at mY own home very little over shc.monthsf ago; gave addresses entirely dlffet"; ent from those he has given the pub--; lic in the near past. Why he should take this attitude, I presume, is his-- own busimess, but I refuse to b€ drawn into acknowledging signing a denial that would: be in-- any WAY a false denialh.. . . e 3 Mr.: Casselman--I am exceedingly annoyed that my name should have been dragged into this unfortunatée discussion. I want to say this: that if the Prime Minister at any tim® banucad ma af '"Isskinp"*I d6k him * Sninh lt ols rey vic un d.\ 1 Te h I should think you I woula say that of that caucus by nre d y n n ols C T2 onE