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EereER ENNE Ts "You didn't hear it You cam late," said Mr. Finlayson. "I came in time to hear that," re turned the Liberal member. When Dr. Simpson refused to re-- tract what he had said, the Minis-- ter remarked: "I (thought, having come from Simcoe, that the member would have gentlemanly instincts." "You can have the chance later. I can bring 200 or 300 people here who heard you say it," said Dr. Dr. Simpson--I'll put my gentle-- manly instincts against yours in Sim-- coe at any time, and in an clection. Mr. Finlayson -- Remember what you said about shouting. _ Dr. Simpson--Are you trying to get from under it? I heard you make the statement. Remark Is Withdrawn. Mr. Finlayson then explained that he had said that there had been ex-- travagance in the department, but that Premier Henry had rectified this situation. Hon. T. L. Kennedy, Minister of Agriculture, asked: "Does the member really believe the statement he just made?" case, the packing plant had enough money to pay off the small amount remaining. In concluding, Dr. Simpson said that the vote on the amendment and subamendment would provide Con-- servative members with an excellen: opportunity of breaking away from Dr. Simpson--I will bring the news-- paper here and read it. 'Then, if he cares to say that he was misquoted, I will accept his word. Dealing with the Barrie packing plant, a farmer's co--operative organi-- zation, Dr. Simpson stated that the Minister of Agriculture had promised financial help. but that nothing had come of it. 'The plant could now pay off every dollar of indebtedness, which was the stipulation made by the Min-- ister. he said. Dr. Simpson--I did not make the statement. That is what many people have asked me. I think it would be wise for the Government to deny that the big interests have control of the Government. Mr. Kennedy--Then I will deny that right now. > Dr. Simpson--Will you go further and make the grant? Mr. Kennedy explained that there was still some debt, but Dr. Simpson replied that much of this had been paid off, and bonds of farmers had been given to cover it. It was merely a mattfir of it,'b_eing collected. In any Mr. Finlayson--You will accept it now, I have no quarrel with the news-- fa-per. You will cither withdraw it or will ask the House to take action. As the Minister said that the quo-- tation was not the exact words used, Dr. Simpson, in accordance with Par-- liamentary rules that a member's word mus; be accepted, withdrew the re-- mark. "And then there was the paymeni to John Aird Jr. I presume that the Prime Minister presided over the Cabinet mseting when that payment was authorized, and I believe that he later made the statement that he was not sure what it was for. It is a queer thing that cheques for that amount should be signed without knowing what they are for." Turning to the question of Hydro, the speaker denied that the Opposi-- tion was trying to destroy the Hydro. "We are merely trying to make it what Sir Adam Beck intended it should be--service at cost, and free from politics." He quoted figures to show the power which had been pur-- chased during the past few years, even since the aepression commenced. "The Hydro has been overbuying, and I do not think the Government would deny it." The payment of $18,000,000 for the Abitibi purchase had been a shock to the people of the Province, he said. Promised Help Lacking. "The people have been wondering why the change of heart. Have the big interests got hold of our Govern-- ment, so that they can control it when this loan is needed? If that is so, then God help the farmer and the country!" Control by Big Interests. "the Tory machine." If they had the courage to do it, they would receive acclaim all over the Province. "It is not their fault. It is the Cabinet which has led them into the mess, and it is a real mess." F. J, McArthur Speaks. | "I will make this statement, and make it unfalteringly--I am brave enough to make it: The time has come when the Government at Ot-- tawa should call for an investigation into the abaitoirs and great packing lhouses of this country. A reason-- 'able profit, which should go to the ; farmer, would be found in the coffers |of the packing houses. They may | say that they make only a small amount on their investment, but any who have had experience with ac-- | counting and bookkeeping know of | the numbers of contingent accounts, | reserves, etc., in order that excess profits may be swa'lowed up," ds-- 'clared Mr. McArthur. Must Help the Farmer. | _ "We must do something for the |\ farmer. He is not getting a fair deal, and I believe that that is where you will find some of the money. I hope to remain in here until the farmer receives a fair profit for his time and labor. Once that is accomplished, I am willing to go back to private busi-- \ ness. Until that time comes, I propose | to stay here, with the help of others, | until the farmers get a fair deal," Mr. | McArthur asserted. In dealing with the problems of the farmers, F. J. McArthur (Conserva-- tive, Northumberland) took issue with those who would trade with Russia. "We have heard much about the barter with Russia. It is just a question of whether the Star can per-- suade the Government to drop into a deal which would be most unsatis-- tory to the people of this country." Russia was a country of 160,000,000 people, secthing with atheism, he declared. "Millions of children are being taught to write, 'There is no God.' Pictures are shown of Rus-- sian workmen sweeping God out of the country and cut of the world. This <is the country with which the Star wants us to do business. "And Hon. Vincent Massey gocs about advising trade with Russia. I would like to ask how much the Massey--Harris Company has lost in credits in Russia I would like to ask J. F. Atkinson, sitting bchind his editorial desk in the Star, how he would like to bring his children or grandchildren up in Russia." Calls for Investigation. Mr. McArthur agreed that the lot | of the farmer was not a happy one. He told of how many farmers pur-- chased cattle in the autumn to feed ; ali winter and have in a finished | condition in the spring. "Often they | get little more in the spring than | they paid for them in the fall. What.' is the solution? It is all right to talk ' of lowering taxes, but if their reve-- mnues continue to decrease more than the taxes they will be no better able to pay the taxes." Using the Oxford Group as an illus-- | tration, the Conservative member | stated that "the collective group on th> other side of the House might sit | back and talk over with one another their political sins of time past. 1 cannot see why they do not sit here under the same head. Why should they be ashamed to call themselves Liberals? Some of the best men we have nad in this Province have been Liberals. "I wish to speak of the honorable member from Brant (Mr. Nixon) as a backsliding brother. I said he first voted for the Conservative Party and left it on the question of reciprocity. At that time it was not good t3 have reciprocal trade. Canada was a young country. Although it was the wrong thing then, it may not be wrong now, and the opportunity is open for him to come over here while there is yet room. "We have not done a great deal here this year as yet but conduct personal attacks. We have no time for that. If we all get together in the interests of the people, and forget these trifling things, it will be much better for this Province," Mr. Mc-- Arthur said. March s. Hon. George H. Challies declared that the Conservative Government at | Ottawa had "done more toward com-- pletl_{xg the_ St. Lawrence waterway ' deal in two years than the King Gov-- ernment had done in a decade." He termed the attitude of the "Lib-- eral Leader in Absentia" as "hypo-- critical," and asserted that Mr. Hep-- burn "sat in the House of Commons and approved of the Beauharnois plundecr and the scheme which forced Ontario to take a block of this power and then, afterward, criticized 'Hydro for purchasing the power." Mr. Challies referred to the Royal Commuission finding on Hydro, and de-- clared that it had completely exoner-- ated the Commission and gave the same answer to "an'ii--Hydro critics" as had been received by them when Sir Adam Beck's Nipigon power de-- velopment had been attacked. Statistics Presented. In a resume of conditions pertain-- ing ot Ontario reformatories, the Provincial Secretary went on to show that while the number sentenced had decreased, the cost had been greater. He was, however, taken to task by Progressive Ieader Nixon, a former Provincial Secretary, who sought an answer as to why the per capita cost had increased. Mr. Challies replied that the number of days prisoners stayed in the jails had increased. Asked by Mr. Nixon if the report on the Burwash inquiry would be brought before the House, Mr. Challies said that would be "a matter of judg-- ment for the department." The speaker told the House that the number of drunk--driving cases had decreased in the Province as fol-- lows: 1927, 822; 1931, 689; and 1932, 564. The number of cases of drunk-- enness had also decreased. To this Mr. Nixon replied that "nobody had any money to buy liquor now." Mr. Nixon--Well, I can tell you that there will be a resolution before the House on the subject. . G, H. Challies Speaks.