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(Continued from Page 1, Column 3.) | cause it concerned the same matter om with previously, Mg > ype then moved a straight = ae. -confidence motion and : ght to reintroduce the subject. In = entorian tones he demanded if a ; atter that had been made the sub- ang ba petition to the Speaker by + 7 members of his group and essrs. Callan and Heenan, Labor members, was not fit subject to oc- | cupy the Legislature in is eration of the Address. Mr secener on that the petition which Mr. coe had sought to introduce and _ — for the consideration of thied, aed tr as me hu bane subsequent consideration ee Gains Some Liberal Support. Again there was a al ruling of the Chair, = Ww. widdie field, Progressive member for North Ontario, being the appellant, and this time Mr. Doherty’s men found three Liberal supporters in A. Belan- ger, Russell; E. Proulx, Prescott, | and H. Fisher, Ottawa. The Chair) was sustained on this divisi y 79 to 20. division by Crowded galleries and chamber | floor witnessed one of the oddest ; | Legislature afternoons in many years, and one which, with its two appeals from the Speaker's rulings, probably set a record. Hundreds more, it was stated by officials, were | unable to gain admittance when the | rie were closed to prevent seri- us overcrow the chs |emetiigies: ding of the chamber Promptly upon the calling of the | orders of the day, Mr. Doherty arose | in his place with a petition in his. j hand, Signed by his 19 supporters. | | He had hardly commenced when A. | Mertusat Sorenie teat wee ; : ised the point }of order that a question of privilege |was debatable only at. the moment |of its being taken. Inasmuch, he | said, as Mr. Doherty had not spoken | to his point on Thursday last when ‘he gave notice, he was now out of |order. Premier Ferguson came to | Mr. Doherty’s momentary rescue. when he said that it was the Gov- | ernment’s desire to give the fullest | freedom to Mr. Doherty, and he ask- ed Mr. Lewis to withdraw his objec- tion. This Mr. Lewis did. Demands Rights of Opposition. Mr. Doherty thanked the Prime ‘Minister, and proceeded to explain his point of privilege. “I am the | Leader of the party in this House.” he said, “which up until July of last | year constituted the Government of | this. Province. Our claim is that under the laws of this Province we | are an Opposition party, and should | be recognized as such.” He went | = je ype the rights and privi- | leges of officia pon Leader of the Op- Premier Ferguson, who hi: cued Mr. Doherty only a pe Rite before, then proceeded to dis 4] lo B | him by the point of order that ~ question he raised was not one of privilege. “Not,” said Mr. Ferguson. | “that I desire to balk his effort.” 4 . | Mr. Raney—Of course not, (Pro- | gressive laughter and applause, ) Mr. Ferguson—Perhaps [| will smile as well later on. Perhaps [| |shall j get just as much enjoyment out of this as honorable members op- posite will. But, coming into a new, ; House, and finding that my honor- jable friends wish strict adherence to its rules, perhaps it is well they| should learn a rule or two at the! outset. Speaker Thompson ruled that if a question affected a member’s per- sonal honor it could be taken up under privilege, but the matter ‘|sought to be introduced by Mr Doherty, he said, was clearly not of that character. There was a proper way of introducing it. And if it were introduced as a question of privilege there could be no discussion. “The honorable member,” he added, “is not going to take up the status of groups and parties as a _ personal grievance, and I rule that the Prime Minister is perfectly correct.” : \U.OLEADER MOVES WANT OF | now ‘cuss it? Not Permitted. Mr. Doherty proceeded to discuss the situation, but was not heard amid Conservative applause. “Do I understand,” he asked, “‘that you make your ruling without per- | mitting us to make any argument?” Mr. Ferguson—Surely. “After hearing the Prime Minis- ter?” put in Mr. Raney. Speaker Thompson reiterated his oh gerale NFIDENCE ‘and promptly substituted an amend- decision not to “sit here and listen to the history of groups and their troubles.” thority— Mr. Ferguson — My honorable friend has made a ruling. It is not debatable. The only privilege he has is to appeal against the ruling. Mr. Doherty—I understand that if this matter is one that concerns | me personally I have a right to dis- Most surely! I come into this House as a representative of ¢| constituency of this Province. I come into this House as a member of a party, and I am, by the Prime Min- ister, relegated to a position that I should not be in. Is it not a matter | ! | that concerns me personally? (Loud ‘Conservative laughter.) Is it nota matter that concerns every individual in this party? I claim that the sub- ject is one that concerns me in my position in this House as representa- tive of the constituency of East Kent and is a matter that concerns 19 members of this House. Speaker Thompson said, “I do not so construe it,’’ and observed that he did not wish any further discus- sion, Raney Takes Up the Cudgels. Mr. Raney sought to ask a ques- tion, and M. M. MacBride, Indepen- dent Labor member for’ Brant, moved that the orders of the day be read, Mr. Raney proceeded, however: “Do I understand’ the Speaker to rule that when the Prime Minister of this Province rises to a point of order and debates it the point of order is going to be de- cided by the Speaker without giving anybody else an opportunity to be heard? Because—— Speaker Thompson—I have made my decision and if the honorable member is not satisfied he has his recourse to appeal. In the mean- time the decision stands. Amid the thunder of Conservative applause, Mr. Raney said, “We will appeal, Mr. Speaker,’ and the Pro- gressives clapped their desks in uni- son with the Conservatives, the Lib- erals remaining intetested specta- tors. The Conservatives and Lib- erals voted solidly to sustain the chair, M. M. MacBride, Independent Labor, voting with them. The Pro- gressives were a unit on the other side, Messrs. Callan and Heenan, Laborites, voting with them. Springs Amendment to the Address. An hour afterward, when the House and galleries had settled! down to a quiet and orderly after-! noon, the argument broke out again.} Mr. Doherty had followed Mr. Sin-} clair in speaking in the debate on) the Address in reply. He introduced! an amendment to the Address, which | read: “Tt is our duty respectfully to sub- mit to your Honor that the Prime! Minister has not the approval of the House in the attempt he has made to curtail the rights and privileges! of the members of this House.” When he picked up his petition, | which was a lengthy and strongly; worded criticism of the non-recogni-} tion of the Progressives, Premier} Ferguson raised the point of order that the Prime Minister had no con-) trol of the situation complained of; ) that the control! was in the hands of the Speaker, and that Mr. Do-_ herty’s action constituted an affront) to Hon. Mr. Thompson. ; Ruled Out of Order. i Speaker Thompson—I don’t see that the Prime Minister in any way tried to restrain the rights and privileges of the members. The amendment is not a matter of fact. so far as I know. I rule the matter | is out of order. | Mr. Raney (amid cries of “Order!” ‘from’ Conservatives)—-Do I under- ‘igtand that the Speaker refuses to hear the complaint of any member ‘of this House against the Prime Min- jister? bt rao aE FI — fm Mr. Doherty—A clearly stated au-| | ‘you have ruled that the subject mat- ge hy ~ Speaker Thompson—You can put! the motion on the order paper and discuss it until you are tired. Mr. Doherty accepted the position, ment that his Honor be advised that “his present advisers have not the confidence of this House.’”’ He sought to bring in the petition on this amendment. Loud Conservative laughter greeted the motion, and R. L. Brackin. K.C., Liberal member for West Kent, raised another shout by calling, “Carried.” Premier Ferguson—Mr. Speaker, ter which it is sought to discuss is out of order; it is an indignity to- ward the Chair to attempt by circul- tous methods or subterfuge to get away from your ruling. Mr. Doherty—I have moved an amendment, and I claim the right to speak to it. Speaker Puts Foot Down. Speaker Thompson—lI suggest that this subject matter be laid on the table and brought up in the proper way. It is not going to be discussed today. That is my ruling again, Mr. Doherty pressed his case, and Speaker Thompson reiterated several | times his refusal to permit, under any of the suggested headings, dis- cussion of Mr. Doherty’s position in the House, and. Mr. Raney, amid Conservative laughter and cries of “Order!’’ again arose to his feet, de- manding to know if the Legislature had got to the point where 19 mem- bers could not appeal to the Speaker, “Do I understand,’ he pressed, “that the Speaker will not permit a petition to him by 19 members of this House to be read in this House?” Speaker Thompson—The point is that the petition should be laid on the table, and not handed to me per- sonally. The discussion raged back and forth until Mr. Widdifield appealed from the Chair’s ruling again. The “Progressive” petition, which is in the hands of the Speaker, cov- ers eight long pages of foolscap, and is presented under the following sub- headings: “The Prime Minister’s action is in flagrant defiance of well-settled prin- cipals of constitutional government.” “The Prime Minister’s action is contrary to a law of the Province, of which the Prime Minister himself was a beneficiary for four years, | while he was the Leader of a mi- i nority Opposition in the Legis- | lature. “The Prime Minister’s action is fn negation of representative govern- | ment.’”’ | “The Prime Minister’s action is an | heretofore unheard-of affront to the | honorable office of Speaker of the | Legislative Assembly of Ontario.” “The Prime Minister’s action is ar- | bitrary and tyrannical.” ! NSE taal ”